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 Possible High Priority Bug 
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
The only things that have changed in regard to shutdown are

1) If the gameop switches a game to inactive without shutting down the server, the player gets booted with only a "disconnected..." message. The only real reason to do that would be a rebang for that game, so a warning isn't that important.

2) If the player exits the game to the start menu, the game will actually close, then re-open and return to the start menu. Before, it would just fall back to the start menu, but this allowed certain variables to be in an undefined state when restarting the game.

3) If TWGS shutdown is used, there is a much more obvious message sent to player prior to shutting down, and that message is displayed regardless of interactive sub-prompt settings or other "silence" modes. A player should always see it.

The situation that Crosby describes is very unusual. He says that he dropped to the startup menu, but as I said above, the game will now close, then restart and return to the startup menu. So the game did close. One possible bug is that the game restarted when it should have just remained at the TWGS menu. The game should only restart in a very specific set of cases, when the game has actually started (player has entered T from startup menu to start the game) and the game ended by falling back to the startup menu and not by halting in any other way. The only ways I know of to fall back to the startup menu are Q from the main prompt or remaining overnight in the Citadel. In all other cases, the game should close and remain closed, leaving the player at the TWGS menu. That's not what Crosby saw.

Based on what Crosby describes, I'm really not sure how that would happen. How could you go from the StarDock menu to the startup menu? It would require dropping out of the game and restarting to the startup menu. Which strongly suggests that there is a bug in the restart logic. And most likely it's caused by certain crash conditions causing the game to restart on exit. That's the only thing that's consistent with what Crosby described. So I'm going to test that and see if there is a way that an abend of TW would be followed by a TW restart by TWGS. If there is, that's easy to fix.

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Tue Jan 31, 2012 10:47 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
Vid Kid wrote:
Since my last battle in testing for the release of TWGS 2.17 .. my conclusion for
the dropping issues stem from the use of Win 7 and twx proxy 2.05 ..

If any of the above is true .. then we just excluded the TWGS from the fault.
Testing in 2.04 and Win XP have not shown this issue ..

Please list OS , TWX Proxy version , and all helpers and possible scripts/bots running during this loss.

I'm sure we can get to the bottom of this if we have not already.

Thank you for playing tradewars ;)


Toyman has already chimed in with similar issues in XP and at 1.X servers. I appreciate what your attempting to do in standardization, but specifically with my case let's assume I'm a semi competent scripter who works for the DOD in a IT capacity.

Let's further assume that while plausible I had mostly ruled out WIN7/2.05 as the culprit and am speaking directly with the Developer and am attempting to discern whether what I dealt with on Toyman's server was the result a plausible bug or client issue. That for all intensive purposes I was being a proactive tester.

In response to the request for details, I would rather not waste John's time with TWX/Client issues outside my plausible bug report as it is clearly not his domain. Presuming that it is entirely the client's fault I will address it with the proper powers that be. Providing the additional data your requesting will not address any of my concern's and actually IMO somewhat derogatory in manner. Given the breadth and context in which we know each other I can't help but feel a clear undertone of contempt in your replies.

So I'm clear for future bug reports what role if any do you play in this sub-forum, is it your domain to field the questions prior to John's response?

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Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:08 pm
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
John Pritchett wrote:
The only things that have changed in regard to shutdown are

1) If the gameop switches a game to inactive without shutting down the server, the player gets booted with only a "disconnected..." message. The only real reason to do that would be a rebang for that game, so a warning isn't that important.

2) If the player exits the game to the start menu, the game will actually close, then re-open and return to the start menu. Before, it would just fall back to the start menu, but this allowed certain variables to be in an undefined state when restarting the game.

3) If TWGS shutdown is used, there is a much more obvious message sent to player prior to shutting down, and that message is displayed regardless of interactive sub-prompt settings or other "silence" modes. A player should always see it.

The situation that Crosby describes is very unusual. He says that he dropped to the startup menu, but as I said above, the game will now close, then restart and return to the startup menu. So the game did close. One possible bug is that the game restarted when it should have just remained at the TWGS menu. The game should only restart in a very specific set of cases, when the game has actually started (player has entered T from startup menu to start the game) and the game ended by falling back to the startup menu and not by halting in any other way. The only ways I know of to fall back to the startup menu are Q from the main prompt or remaining overnight in the Citadel. In all other cases, the game should close and remain closed, leaving the player at the TWGS menu. That's not what Crosby saw.

Based on what Crosby describes, I'm really not sure how that would happen. How could you go from the StarDock menu to the startup menu? It would require dropping out of the game and restarting to the startup menu. Which strongly suggests that there is a bug in the restart logic. And most likely it's caused by certain crash conditions causing the game to restart on exit. That's the only thing that's consistent with what Crosby described. So I'm going to test that and see if there is a way that an abend of TW would be followed by a TW restart by TWGS. If there is, that's easy to fix.


I've confirmed that the client (TWX) will show the message I received if the TWGS server suddenly drops (Power, CTRL-ALT-DEL, Etc..) I was able to replicate it multiple times on my own personal server.

Thank you for your assistance in this matter and clarifying some of the behind the scene stuff, sockets are interesting though there is nothing that can be done about unintended shutdown's.

Interestingly enough I was also able to replicate Crosby's issue by stopping the service TW2002 in Task Manager while in game. Maybe not that interesting to some, but I think it's neat the game will kick the player out but not off when loss of game connection happen. One would think that the Server would drop the player in lieu of game connection.

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Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:44 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
I have not been able to reproduce a case where the player ends up at the startup menu after being dropped. You're saying you've been able to do that?

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Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:08 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
John Pritchett wrote:
I have not been able to reproduce a case where the player ends up at the startup menu after being dropped. You're saying you've been able to do that?


Yes in the process of attempting to replicate the error I was receiving on the other server. My secondary test player whom was not out of the game yet was dropped to the game menu when I terminated via task manager the TW2002 Service. I will also add this to my to do to attempt to replicate and append log's as needed.

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Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:26 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
When I get my second box in a few weeks I'm going to test windows 7 heads up against win xp and see if that is the problem. I'm willing to bet that I get more problems from the TWGS using windows 7. I test with Caretaker and the person that has the most problems with us is using windows 7.

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Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:36 pm
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
-=shadow=- wrote:
When I get my second box in a few weeks I'm going to test windows 7 heads up against win xp and see if that is the problem. I'm willing to bet that I get more problems from the TWGS using windows 7. I test with Caretaker and the person that has the most problems with us is using windows 7.

Don't forget those using Win7 also use TWX 2.05 which has several bugs that have been reported.

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Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:58 pm
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
Kaus wrote:
John Pritchett wrote:
I have not been able to reproduce a case where the player ends up at the startup menu after being dropped. You're saying you've been able to do that?


Yes in the process of attempting to replicate the error I was receiving on the other server. My secondary test player whom was not out of the game yet was dropped to the game menu when I terminated via task manager the TW2002 Service. I will also add this to my to do to attempt to replicate and append log's as needed.


I was able to replicate it again same settings. I ctrl-alt-deleted and end tasked the "2002.exe *32 "which caused the player to drop to the game menu from the sector they were currently in. Not sure if that's intentional for it to drop to game menu instead of from the server intentionally. I did however tell you I would attempt it again and was successful 3 more times. No log naturally since it's an abrupt end to the service.

Code:

Sector  : 12922 in uncharted space.
Ports   : Eros Annex, Class 3 (SBB)
Planets : (M) e
Warps to Sector(s) :  (5556) - (9340)

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[12922] (?=Help)? :

                               Who's Playing

Civilian test1

The Alien Traders are on the move!
The Ferrengi are on the move!

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[12922] (?=Help)? : D
<Re-Display>

Sector  : 12922 in uncharted space.
Ports   : Eros Annex, Class 3 (SBB)
Planets : (M) e
Warps to Sector(s) :  (5556) - (9340)

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[12922] (?=Help)? :
TradeWars Game Server                                     Copyright (C) EIS
TWGS v2.18b                                               www.eisonline.com

Server registered to Dark Dominion
Supports up to 25 games and 100 nodes

<A> Test

<#> Players Online
<!> View game descriptions

<Q> Quit

Selection (? for menu):

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Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:16 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
Let's be sure we're talking about the same thing. If you kill the executable, the player should drop to the TWGS menu. What I thought you were saying was that the player dropped to the TW startup menu, which would be a bug. So are you saying your player dropped to the TWGS menu or the TW startup menu (T-menu)? If it's the latter, this is normal.

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Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:34 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
John Pritchett wrote:
Let's be sure we're talking about the same thing. If you kill the executable, the player should drop to the TWGS menu. What I thought you were saying was that the player dropped to the TW startup menu, which would be a bug. So are you saying your player dropped to the TWGS menu or the TW startup menu (T-menu)? If it's the latter, this is normal.


Please clarify the difference, as I understand it the player dropped to the TWGS menu which supports the game letters.

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"This one claims to have been playing since 1993 and didn't know upgrading a port would raise his alignment."


Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:43 am
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Unread post Re: Possible High Priority Bug
TradeWars Game Server Copyright (C) EIS
TWGS v2.18b www.eisonline.com

Server registered to Epic Interactive Strategy
Supports up to 25 games and 100 nodes

<A> My Game <W> Dean Bug

<#> Players Online
<!> View game descriptions

<Q> Quit

Selection (? for menu):


That's the TWGS menu, and that's where the player should end up when the game ends either by a crash or by shutting it down from task manager.



==-- Trade Wars 2002 --==

T - Play Trade Wars 2002
I - Introduction & Help
S - View Game Settings
H - High scores
M - View Access Modes
X - Exit

Enter your choice:

This is the startup menu, which is in-game, and you should only end up here if you leave the game normally by Q from the main command menu or staying overnight in the Citadel.

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Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:47 am
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