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 A Subzero Christmas Tournament 
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Chief Warrant Officer
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Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2017 3:02 pm
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Location: Salisbury, North Carolina
Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Now The Fastest TWGS in the West

Can I be The Fastest TWGS in the East?

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Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:35 pm
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Lieutenant J.G.
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Hammer_2 wrote:
I'm just up and haven't read most of the above.

We were actively following corp 2 trying track them via limpets and their pgridding.

I saw someone mow past two of our figs. We did a nearest fig. Low and behold there is corp 1 and 2 in same sector shooting it out. Judging by the amount of exp corp 2 gained I assumed they used *alot* of fighters.

So we went in and took advantage of the situation.

We know exactly where corp 1 was as they took the figs out of that bubble a couple of days earlier.

Any time corp 2 attacks corp 1 door, and I notice via logs or your one liners in fed space, I'm going to turn up and try and take advantage of it.
It's called tactics.

We hadn't attacked corp 1 in a couple of days becuase we know where they are and felt we had put enough pressure on them. Hence we'd been looking for corp 2's location. However we arent' going to look a gift horse in the mouth (excuse the pun).

I've not said a word to either corp during the whole game. Particularly since corp 2 think I'm a a$$hole for suggesting there was mega corping the previous game and assume are still not talking to me :)


This is all entirely possible. The timing is also highly suspicious. It sure happened fast, in the middle of the night, to be coincidental.

The logs can't prove it, as they virtually never can in potential mega corping cases. So, we'll leave it at that. I know how I personally feel about the two of you coming in less than 2 minutes apart, but I also know there's a small chance it was a coincidence, so I will accept that at this point and move on.

Sultan doesn't need to make a ruling. Let's just keep playing.

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Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:42 pm
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Chief Warrant Officer
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
I also have no interest in megacorping, unless it's a game where it's built into the rules.

It's just not worth winning that badly.


Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:57 pm
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Lieutenant J.G.

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:39 pm
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Ok thanks Shadow,

I get how it looks but it was was a funny coincidence. Let's play on and enjoy.

Prepare to die; both corps!

Thanks again for hosting SB.

Hammer


Sat Jan 05, 2019 6:10 pm
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Lieutenant J.G.
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Hammer_2 wrote:
Ok thanks Shadow,

I get how it looks but it was was a funny coincidence. Let's play on and enjoy.

Prepare to die; both corps!

Thanks again for hosting SB.

Hammer


Prepare to die!


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Sat Jan 05, 2019 6:20 pm
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Chief Warrant Officer
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Thank you Hammer. It is my pleasure. I knew if I threw enough Dummys I’m the playpen, the kids would play nice. I was think I would have to declare Your Mom winner of the tournament.

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Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:01 pm
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
That wasn't very nice War!


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Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:33 am
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Lieutenant J.G.

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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Micro wrote:
That wasn't very nice War!


Just wanted to really put this mega corping stuff to bed :)


Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:56 pm
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Hammer_2 wrote:
Micro wrote:
That wasn't very nice War!


Just wanted to really put this mega corping stuff to bed :)

We know you are mega corping with C1 anyway. Muaahhahaaaaa ;)

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Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:56 pm
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Lieutenant J.G.

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:39 pm
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Micro wrote:
Hammer_2 wrote:
Micro wrote:
That wasn't very nice War!


Just wanted to really put this mega corping stuff to bed :)

We know you are mega corping with C1 anyway. Muaahhahaaaaa ;)


I'm mega corping with Your Mom!


Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:07 pm
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Sergeant Major

Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:00 am
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
I don't have a dog in this fight, but the definition of mega-corps being used here I don't particularly like. Strategic alliances and partnerships are not unusual and seem to me a legitimate strategy. To me a mega-corp is one where players playing under multiple teams are attempting to get around the limit on team size and have no intention of actually challenging each other for the win.

In a game with a very strong team and two weaker ones it would only make sense for the two weaker ones to join forces against the stronger one first, then take on each other for the win. If either tried to go against the big dog they'd just get eaten and the strong team would be that much stronger against the remaining one.

Deign


Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:47 am
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Lieutenant J.G.
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Deign wrote:
In a game with a very strong team and two weaker ones it would only make sense for the two weaker ones to join forces against the stronger one first, then take on each other for the win. If either tried to go against the big dog they'd just get eaten and the strong team would be that much stronger against the remaining one.
Deign


Funny you mention that, because the other team teams either did exactly that or something else is stinking in how they pulled off their come back from the dead win tonight.

After we invaded them earlier, leaving them with 3 planets and about 4 million figs, they got their two dead players back at midnight (3am US east time) and came to the door to try to reclaim their planets.

We had two players in front of the door with an L6 planet with over 2 million fighters on it:

Planet #38 in sector 17875: White Horse
Class E, Red Rider Double Action BB Gun
Created by: Famine
Claimed by: Woodland Critters [1]

Item Colonists Colonists Daily Planet Ship Planet
(1000s) 2 Build 1 Product Amount Amount Maximum
------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------
Fuel Ore 298,657 1 298,657 1,073,388 0 7,500,000
Organics 3,003 1 3,003 3,632 0 2,000,000
Equipment 298,377 1 298,377 182,040 0 2,000,000
Fighters N/A 2 300,018 2,264,771 280,000 7,500,000

The two players were in Subterfuge Enterras (renamed in this game) with 4.1:1 def odds and defender bonus, going against Ascian Boats with 4.4 offensive odds, producing a net defensive advantage of 3.728:1.

At those odds, it should have taken them 8,441,419 fighters to kill the two players in sector who were running a modified reloader that landed at random intervals (not the same each time) that were very different, ensuring that there was always one of them in sector no matter what.

They took out the two tholian ships, invaded the planet with 372 fighters left on it (so they did not kill any planet fighters to speak of -- they actually killed the tholians) and ultimately succeeded in invading.

As further evidence they killed the tholians, these three players all had 0 exp when the invasion started:

1 371,103 4,500,000 3 Death Santa's Sleigh of Candy Canes
2 243,950 4,500,000 3 War Santa's Sleigh of Candy Canes
3 53,320 4,500,000 3 Famine You'll Shoot You're Eye Out

This was a game with three corps and corpinfo just before the invasion produced this:

S: Corp fighters: 2917964 Game fighters: 12205518

Okay, so the real question is this. In a game where we had 2,264,771 fighters on planet and 2,917,764 total, and there were three active corps running every day so presumably the other corp had more than half of what was left (well over half actually since we took almost everything corp 3 had earlier in the day)... how did they manage to use 8,441,419 figs when they should have had approximately 4 million total to work with?

I know they didn't have any on ships because I capped virtually all of their ships.

I am mystified.

I mean, congratulations guys, but unless you know something I don't, this does not make any reasonable sense. You did not come up with at least 4 million additional figs with 2 players in a 3,000 turn game in less than 6 hours.

So, what happened?

As an aside, there was this earlier in the day after the invasion...

War well, we found another bug in twars, which i'll reveal post game
War that might have made it over for you already
War lol, I know.. this one really provided a major sad face from me hehehe

Kind of curious about that, right about now.

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Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:25 am
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Lieutenant J.G.

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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
LOL,

Shadow,

Do the maths...

DO THE MATHS....

Do I have to explain it every time something happens in this game you don't like or don't understand?


Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:38 am
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Lieutenant J.G.

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:39 pm
Posts: 320
Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
FYI: bug is a random plock issue.

We had a plock in your back bubble (First one we evicted you from) fail randomly. So you got to live there an extra day.

Then twice in your door, one including when you moved the door forward. So that was going to be a devasting blow from our point of view on you. And I know how they work and test it thoroughly in another game.. well I'm sure I know, these just fail randomly.

and as for the big mystery on fighters..

Well, you didn't invade one planet which had 4 mil figs and two players on it.
I wonder what else it had?? oh that's right, a citadel treasurey. The planet with the MOST fighters funnily enough had all the cash.

We haven't BOUGHT a fighter since day 2-3... we had 5.5mil cols? so yeah, who needs to buy them when you make 2-3mil per day.

I mean, surely if you do the maths on what 3mil plus on equipment makes? that's around 500mil a day BEFORE we use a turn.

We had almost 2 billion in the cit, hence was going to invade you tonight or tomorrow. You beat us to the punch. And you did a genuinely awesome job of ALMOST taking us out. I'm legit when I say well done, we thought we were so far ahead it wasn't funny. So we were lazy.

I can't say more as there is another corp in the game, WHO ARE NOT OUR PARTNERS. However, we barely did it, and if we didn't do it just then, we loose, because those 4:1 odds are a killer.

FYI: happy to send logs to SB, it's all there where the money came from.


Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:13 am
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Gameop

Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2007 2:41 am
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Unread post Re: A Subzero Christmas Tournament
Shadow,

Come on man. Mega? We did't communicate with anyone this game. That is now how we play. You best of all should know this about us from previous games when you asked us and we declined. Not our style. As hammer said, the planet with 4 mil figs would have been worth invading. You could have ended the game right there for us.

Great timing on your invasion. Caught us with our pants down and had us on the brink of being done. I mean 500 figs in our door sector. Shame on us there. lol . We should have known you wouldn't turtle the whole game but you beat us to the punch and you made us pay.

But ........ you didn't go for the kill shot and you paid for it.

I wish I could have been at the keys last night for the rebound. Hammer and MD had a plan to kill or be killed and go out in a blaze of glory. Great job and now to look for any stray planets and ships and then prepare for the next battle with other corp.

Great job.

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Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:59 am
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