The ones who have left the game, I don't think have even visited this forum yet, I'm referring to those who haven't played in 10-15 years who find a link to a server and jump in, not knowing how this game is played now. That's what I'm seeing in the link Comet found.

And I know some have left because they think the latest version is "broken", when in reality it's not.

Most of the newbies I've spoken with have never come accross this forum, or if they have, they find the process to register too much trouble. I've not been through the process myself, I'm pre-spam filter.

We now have "the other" forum, and I'll admit I get a kick out of smack, I'm the #2 poster there, but that was ingrained in me back in the old fido.net days, when smack and flame wars were fun and a big part of playing this game.

So that's how you got in,.. I'd always wondered



Some friendly banter is all good, but it's become personal in nature often, and simply dilutes the content of this (or any forum). I log into the other forum simply because of the tournament and post there because of it. But frankly I find little usefull or interesting content over there. What little information is packed inbetween pages of useless chatter. This is why I say we need to keep from getting to that point here.

I have 20 years with the game and left about nine months ago. Certainly real life had a toll but the constant bickering and childishness has really kept me away.

Cruncher, honestly I have no issue with you outside your incessant "speak for the noobs" ego rants when you yourself don't quite understand the game yet.

I understand the game well enough, what I don't yet know is how to use the TWX and Mombot scripts, or how to write one. I've written a few things in Zoc.

I understand that you can do a great many things in the game that are only possible if you are using TWX.

If we want to increase the player base, it starts at the bottom up, with the noobs. Why don't you understand that?

You presume I don't understand your intent. You presume allot of things and that about sums of my distaste of cruncher 2.0 (yes I knew you in the old days too). Instead of answering your question with a statement I'll ask you similar questions.

Why can't you acknowledge that maybe you don't speak for unrepresented masses?

Are you aware that having JP's ear does not make you any authority? I'll kindly remind you that part of my signature is a quote from you.

When will you acknowledge that you are largely responsible for driving a stake between the player base that was here before your return and those that came after you?

IMO there is room for all types of players and wether you intend on it or not, as a advocate for JP both here and on Facebook your anti scripting and "my way is best" attitude has and will continue to drive players off this forum. I myself am considering asking JP to delete this account as a way to prevent myself from returning.

I say this only two days after buying a dedicated server to host tw games because I was starting to want to come back. But after getting more involved in these forums as of recent. I'm second guessing it and considering appropriating it as a DVD/BD server in my house.

This has nothing to do with the changes but almost entirely with wanting to space myself from the impending Implosion of this community.

Sorry guys but hate to say it, your beating a dead horse! Cruncher thinks she knows whats best for the game, and its just not true!!!! Honestly, JP shouldnt be asking her for any advice on what does and doesnt need changed!! IMO Cruncher still has alot of game leraning to do herself!! By the looks of it Iam not the only one saying this!!! What needs to happen is JP needs to spend about a year or so playing TW, and then let him make up his own mind what needs changed or added!!!!

Getting a little overly dramatic now? This is only a game, this is only a request for a sysop toggle, don't use it.

I am NOT JP's representative. Rev asked me to co-admin the FB page.

I'm just a player/sysop who's asking for a toggle. Seriously what is the big deal? Are you afraid that more players will like to play the game without TWX?

This toggle won't even break TWX or Mombot. It will just slow turbo scripts down to normal speed. The difference is only a few MilliSeconds that is spent displaying some text that the average script will ignore.

Yeap, it will move TWX at the same speed as Swath, I'm presuming. That's the whole point.

We've been racing Corvettes next to VW Beatles. Put us all at the same speed, then we'll see who has game skill. Then average Joe's who aren't IT geeks and programmers will be able to enjoy the game using only Swath.

If that is the case put a banner at your server that says SWATH ONLY and stop "presuming" what needs to be changed and doesnt need to be!!!! By the looks of your last post your trying to drag good players down to your noob level!!! I could only use swath and macros and beat most of the players today! With that being said skills and game knowledge doesnt come in a scripts or TWX form, it takes time and OJT!!!! If you want to do something useful ask a scripter to hold script classes on TS to help lower skilled players and try being quite for a change, listen when people tell you how todo something instead of saying the same old crap " I know what iam doing i use to play back in the HVS days"
jesus christ!!

No, I personally am all for any changes including your toggle. The very fact that JP after year's of not being around; is again fixing the TWGS Server is a great thing and a effort that I don't take lightly.

If you're not JP's representative why have you Admin his TWGS server?

Speak directly with him in a Authoritative posture regarding issues of newer players?

What makes you the most experianced player who knows whats broken or even how to fix said issues?

The fact of the matter Cruncher is wether you choose to admit it or not your Anti-Scripting Rehtoric wears on the people who put years of effort into perfecting said scripts and learning the nuances of TW2002 strategy. We (The Scripter/Non-Scripter) players who were here before you learned to adapt to a program that was realeased after JP Left (TWX) without any additional assistance.

Furthermore what you experiance as a newer player is a normal progression of returning players we've seen time and again. I myself went through it and after frustrations of dieing in competitive games to faster than human movements I not only employed scripts/twx/swath I also learned how to write them.

I do not expect you to "Adapt or Die!" or even learn how to script. However if you enter a new/advanced game against someone who script's in a game that support's scripting I do expect you not to come to the forum's to complain (Loudly) about it and demand change because you got pwned by someones mass colonizer that blew up a planet under you.

You can't have your cake and eat it too Chuncher. Either your against automated movement or you're not otherwise it get's to conviluted. Multiple times you have made it clear that you're against it but yet you continually ask for help with scripts including those in mombot. That makes you a hypocrit in my eyes and hard to take seriously when you advocate so heavily against said scripts.

What you purpose (newbie friendly settings) allready exists on multiple servers. ICE9 being IMO the best example of a "newbie - friendly" server. His automated backend scripts largely prevent players from abusing his economy. What the scripts don't prevent the players (Yes the players, GASP) suppliment with their own actions.

I'm all for further sysop toggles because it makes the life of a server admin easier without writing complicated backends. Which in turn help curtail and prevent people from abusing the spirit of the bang. But this crusade you're on has to stop it's literally been over a year of non-stop "I'm the bigshot" attitude and anti-scripter were the devil statements.

TLDR: I'm not against toggles of any kind. Stop with the Anti-Scripting Rhetoric, it only creates further division in the playerbase.

I'm against unnecessary toggles. Ones that make the game
act differently. I want noobs and returnees to find the same
game they left, not a new version with them scratching their
heads and wondering if there wasn't something else back when
they used to play....



I didn't say it would break twx or mom. I said the free scripts
that come with twx would be tubed. What I meant was that they
will send "CN9" and wait for the CN to change from SPACE to
ALLKEYS...and hang there waiting. It will basically bungle up all the
free public scripts that come with twx. There is no decent reason
to do this. I'm sorry, but I have yet to hear a good reason to remove
this feature of the game.

JP made public several times the remote sysop pw for the sandbox game. That’s the only game on the beta server I had Admin on, we all did.



Those of you who rode out JP’s absence, and had the stubbornness to stick it out and learn, because you wanted to play that badly AND there were no other options. If you wanted to play, you had to go through what you did to learn how to play with and against advanced scripts. You are unique. You are also in the minority of TW players. Most players left, because they were not as determined as you are, including me.



How many times do I have to say this, I use scripts, I write Zoc scripts and I’m learning to use advanced TWX scripts. I may try writing one some day.

But, as a player and a sysop I see the huge divide, and understand that advanced play is mainly the realm of programmers, and IT professionals. The problem happens when those who don’t write (script kiddies), use these public scripts against newbies and chase them away. That is unless they are one of the unique players such as yourself who stick it out.

My goal is and always has been to help make this game more player friendly for the general public, with publically open games. I’ve played Ice-9, I’m sorry but unless you are a well behaved, sub servant little noob, the sharks are there and they will take you out! I know, T0yman took me out there.

Exactly! You are looking at post 2002 returnees, those who already used TWX.

I'm looking at early '90 returnees, who's last game was probably the dialup MBBS HVS version. These are the players coming back, scratching their heads wondering why every sector in the universe has a fighter in it.

If I get this toggle, the game will be clearly named, players will be quite aware of the settings used.

I would love to have this toggle in a test beta that I would run on my server only.

If the early '90 returnees cannot fathom the idea to adjust and learn like most of us have had to do (since some of us started out at the beginning and left for a bit, then returned to changes before all this crap in the last year), then perhaps they need to stick to playing cards. The only reason the returnees may be wondering how a fig can be in every sector is because back when we played "manual" it was time consuming and almost impossible to put a fig in every sector. Now with higher turns and scripts, it can be done.

I do not buy the argument of "we need the change for the returnee '90 players" because I have played since the beginning and had to learn. Why are we suddenly wanting things handed out on a platter? Just because you and your buddy do not like the script kiddies does not mean the rest of us "older" players also feel the same. It is you who are in the minority, not the rest of us.

That is what we call "arrogant presumption". If you are stuck, perhaps you can find someone to help you with the meaning. And for the record, you and your groupies are not the only "old generation" players here on the forum. We are here, we do come to the forum- we just prefer not to get drawn into the senseless debates. The game is what it is. Play the new version, stay with the old version. People leave because real life affects them, not because of scripts, unlimited turns, or any other dumb excuse.