Stop, you are learning bad habits in the other forum. Just agree to disagree and let it go.

H

Let me stink it up a little more for you.

I remember the learning curve even back then. before you could become an accomplished player, you had to take your lumps and slowly, over time, learn all the bugs and cheats that were available before and during the HVS MBBS years.

All of those have been worked out of the game. maybe the real problem is that everyone truly is on even footing now and there is no more 'excitement' in learning how to farm a million figs in one afternoon or mega rob a port for millions in one pass eh?

In other words, most likely it's not going to matter. It is a geeks game and unless it goes gooey at some level, it will always remain a geeks game. Geeks are typically smart staring and interacting with code but put them in a room full of people and they just huddle in the corner with their koolaid.

So there, now can we get back to finding new bugs and ways to screw the sysop?

Daala, if you're upset about a change that wasn't an option (TEDIT changes), you shouldn't use that as reason for opposing an option. It's apples and oranges. We can discuss whether the TEDIT changes were worthwhile and whether they should have been made optional, but that has nothing to do with whether or not an option should be added to the game. With very rare exceptions, and the TEDIT update is one of them, any changes to the game are done in a way that will only effect those who want to use the option.

In the case of the TEDIT changes, one reason I went ahead with those changes is because I'm working toward phasing TEDIT out as an interface for server-side scripting. TEDIT can't be a useful tool for both human editing and for script-based editing at the same time. For human editing, it needs to be able to evolve as new functionality is needed, including possibly reorganizing screens to make room for new functionality (not just new features, but old functionality that was never properly supported). For scripted editing, it needs a stable, consistent interface. Those two needs are at odds. So I want to provide a tool for server-side scripting that can be used instead of TEDIT. I will be releasing it soon. And I hope that it will provide enough of an improvement over TEDIT scripting that you'll want to rewrite your scripts to use it. I love what gameops have done with server-side scripting, but it is an unsupported use of the product. Once there is a devoted interface for server-side scripting, that will free me up to modify TEDIT as I feel necessary without stepping on the toes of gameops like you who have put so much effort into customizing your games. And in addition, it will greatly expand a gameop's ability to customize games through server-side scripts.

That's the two-edged sword of change. There are better ways to interface with the game than by scripting TEDIT. But for gameops who have been writing server-side scripts for years, it's a major burden to ask them to transition to a new interface. I can only hope that the advantages of the new system will make it worthwhile, and promise to work with those gameops to make sure that it is.

But that's not really what this is about. The vast majority of changes will be optional. A feature like what Cruncher requests, if implemented, would be truly optional. The TEDIT update is a special case. I am sorry if you're bugged by it. I hope in the end it will be worthwhile to you. I know that it will benefit far more than it will inconvenience in the long run.

I understand that, and I am not upset over any changes to TEDIT. I mean, you changed the admin interface where we use to use the $ key to switch to TEDIT mode and there was a change to one of the menus for activating games or something like that. I adjusted our server-side scripts finally to accept the new changes and retained the older ones for v1.xx. I managed to get everything to where we want it to be and that aspect is all good.

I am just flustered at the constant arrogant attitude and comments like "twx proxy destroyed the game" or "you script kiddies".

Or I can quote this:



In the course of over a year, nothing has changed except this constant bickering and whining. Scripts exist, and if this is such an issue then I ask why was it even allowed to get this far. We all have to learn something at some point. Having features that are toggled to enable/disable is a great approach and I welcome that. Having the constant comments of the above mentioned gets dull and tiresome after awhile. The game is what it is, and either just play and have fun or don't play. It does not do a community well when there is this chasm that spans a great distance and causes segregation. Cruncher and her merry band are NOT the only ones that love this game or care about the community. Many of us have contributed to it and wish to continue doing so.

I agree completely. It gets tiresome to always see this constant argument. There are many ways people enjoy this game, and no way is "the right way". If some people are turned off by the way the game has been played, it's my fault for not providing ways for those players to have games that they can enjoy. It's not the fault of players who play the game in whatever ways the game allows. Players can and should push the game to its limits, as long as they're not abusing bugs. But at the same time, when player "innovation" fundamentally changes the game, the only solution is to add an option to limit that tactic so that players who don't like it can still play the game. For years, I was not responding to changes in the game caused by the creativity of players, and a certain playing style became established as "mainstream". Now I'm trying to shake things up a bit and open the game back up to other play styles. I just wish we could avoid all of this competition over which play style is the best.

Where are all these massive amounts of players that prefer to play without scripts? What servers are all the supporters of delays, non-abort displays, and slow ping rates playing at? Where are all the players at that were suppose to flock to the v2 servers? I highly doubt that the players refusing to play v2 are in the minority here.
The busiest server I've seen is UTW, running on v1.03 and providing mostly unlimited turn truce games. Why would that be if v2 is so popular and everyone wants these changes?

Just a few questions you might ask yourself before you alienate your current player base.

This has mostly not been about V2 at ALL. Honestly the fact that your taking this moment to attack John is... Well... Immature.

Crosby as i understand it is simply stating he'd rather see his time spent on other more relevant changes than a optinal display that won't affect play at all. I agree 100%

Dalaa and I, among afew others are upset about Cruncher's constant need to downplay, diss, and crusade against those of us who adapted and supported this game.

End of story

Please don't egg this on.

H

But that's the thing, one way is only best in the eyes of the player. The two styles are like water and oil, they cannot be mixed.

The more I learn about TWX and what's possible, the more I'm convinced that we need this toggle. TWX is very powerful, and quite honestly I feel pretty much useless not knowing how to script. I am enjoying the creativity of T0yman and Xanos and thier ability to whip something up on the fly that works wonderfully. I'm having fun helping them test scripts, I got to run one that was amazing! What Xanos accomplished with that script is entirely impossible for any one using only Swath. With 1 second phontons, we were able to photon from a Missile Friggate, transport to an ISS, tow the Missile friggate, and repeat 5 hops getting past enemy armids and fighters to successfully land on our L3 planet. That move took a total of 10 seconds, give or take a few ms. Then T0yman wrote a script to warp the planet out at the top of the hour, before it collided.

That was how we celebrated New Year's Eve... unfortuately that adrenaline rush causes us to also loose T0yman, so it was bitter sweet.

Edit: What part of please stop did you misunderstand?