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Cruncher
Ambassador
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 4016 Location: USA
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 Re: Challenge
Micro wrote: Cruncher wrote: I dunno, low turns favor reds. I can outcash blues and take all those colos! Muhahaha.... Fine, I'll just change the Steal/Rob factors then.  The reality is, it's very hard to make a truly balanced game. Every edit favors either red or blue. That's why most teams run a split corp, they get the best of both styles.
_________________
BOTE 1998 Champs: Team Fament HHT 2015 Champs: Cloud09 Big Game 2016 Champs: Draft team HHT 2018 Champs: Rock Stars Big Game 2019 Champs: Draft Team
Classic Style Games Here: telnet://crunchers-twgs.com:2002 Web page from 1990's: https://web.archive.org/web/20170103155645/http://tradewars.fament.com/Cruncher/tradewar.htm Blog with current server info: http://cruncherstw.blogspot.com Discord: https://discord.gg/4dja5Z8 E-mail: Cruncherstw@gmail.com FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/CrunchersTW
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| Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:42 pm |
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Micro
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:19 pm Posts: 2559 Location: Oklahoma City, OK 73170 US
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 Re: Challenge
Cruncher wrote: The reality is, it's very hard to make a truly balanced game. Every edit favors either red or blue. That's why most teams run a split corp, they get the best of both styles. Hourly penalties for split corps... ... and blue's penalty is INCREASED experience 
_________________ Regards, Micro Website: http://www.microblaster.net TWGS2.20b/TW3.34: telnet://twgs.microblaster.net:2002
ICQ is Dead Jim! Join us on Discord: https://discord.gg/zvEbArscMN
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| Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:44 am |
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Kavanagh
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 1410 Location: Boo! inc. Ireland
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 Re: Challenge
Micro wrote: Cruncher wrote: The reality is, it's very hard to make a truly balanced game. Every edit favors either red or blue. That's why most teams run a split corp, they get the best of both styles. Hourly penalties for split corps... ... and blue's penalty is INCREASED experience  Or, just revert to the original pre TWGS: Mixed corp, every corpie went to zero exp at extern. Big problem before L4 , and especially before megarob bug known. Back then, we had megacorps - a red corp and a blue corp allied. Since TWGS, megacorp is not PC.
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| Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:31 pm |
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Cruncher
Ambassador
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 4016 Location: USA
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 Re: Challenge
Kavanagh wrote: Micro wrote: Cruncher wrote: The reality is, it's very hard to make a truly balanced game. Every edit favors either red or blue. That's why most teams run a split corp, they get the best of both styles. Hourly penalties for split corps... ... and blue's penalty is INCREASED experience  Or, just revert to the original pre TWGS: Mixed corp, every corpie went to zero exp at extern. Big problem before L4 , and especially before megarob bug known. Back then, we had megacorps - a red corp and a blue corp allied. Since TWGS, megacorp is not PC. Yeah, back then it was more of a strategy game and less of a scripting game. Fun times!
_________________
BOTE 1998 Champs: Team Fament HHT 2015 Champs: Cloud09 Big Game 2016 Champs: Draft team HHT 2018 Champs: Rock Stars Big Game 2019 Champs: Draft Team
Classic Style Games Here: telnet://crunchers-twgs.com:2002 Web page from 1990's: https://web.archive.org/web/20170103155645/http://tradewars.fament.com/Cruncher/tradewar.htm Blog with current server info: http://cruncherstw.blogspot.com Discord: https://discord.gg/4dja5Z8 E-mail: Cruncherstw@gmail.com FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/CrunchersTW
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| Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:06 pm |
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CBYNot
Chief Warrant Officer
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:32 pm Posts: 104
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 Re: Challenge
Cruncher wrote: Kavanagh wrote: Micro wrote: Cruncher wrote: The reality is, it's very hard to make a truly balanced game. Every edit favors either red or blue. That's why most teams run a split corp, they get the best of both styles. Hourly penalties for split corps... ... and blue's penalty is INCREASED experience  Or, just revert to the original pre TWGS: Mixed corp, every corpie went to zero exp at extern. Big problem before L4 , and especially before megarob bug known. Back then, we had megacorps - a red corp and a blue corp allied. Since TWGS, megacorp is not PC. Yeah, back then it was more of a strategy game and less of a scripting game. Fun times! I see you're still operating under the false assumption that scripts somehow free you from having to develop a strategy. It's actually quite the opposite - the more advanced the scripts you and your opponents are using, the more time you should be spending thinking about your strategy and discussing it with your corpies. For instance, it's quite a bit easier to best the cashing of someone doing manual PPT than it is to beat the cashing of someone merching thousands of gridded sectors. It's quite a bit easier to counter an attack from someone taking 10 seconds to fire a photon, waltz into a base, land and attack figs and shields, and xport out, than it is to counter the same attack from someone doing it in 0.1 seconds. Scripts force people to *sharpen* their strategic skills, not abandon them.
_________________ "TW: A proud tradition of...change is the only constant."
-Val
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| Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:21 pm |
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Micro
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:19 pm Posts: 2559 Location: Oklahoma City, OK 73170 US
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 Re: Challenge
CBYNot wrote: Scripts force people to *sharpen* their strategic skills, not abandon them. No, it just forces you to keep updating your scripts until they are better than your opponents scripts.
_________________ Regards, Micro Website: http://www.microblaster.net TWGS2.20b/TW3.34: telnet://twgs.microblaster.net:2002
ICQ is Dead Jim! Join us on Discord: https://discord.gg/zvEbArscMN
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| Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:46 pm |
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CBYNot
Chief Warrant Officer
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:32 pm Posts: 104
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 Re: Challenge
Micro wrote: CBYNot wrote: Scripts force people to *sharpen* their strategic skills, not abandon them. No, it just forces you to keep updating your scripts until they are better than your opponents scripts. This is a very old argument but I'll just reiterate this one point again: give a chimp an AK-47 and he'll be just as likely to shoot himself as someone else. The power of scripting doesn't come from updates or changes but from finding new and creative strategies for using those tools. Most of the best strategies - yes, strategies, not scripts - that I use were thought up in response to a strategy someone else cooked up to utilize their scripts. If you can't understand the distinction, I'm not sure what to tell you, other than I'll be happy to stay off your lawn... 
_________________ "TW: A proud tradition of...change is the only constant."
-Val
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| Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:59 am |
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Micro
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:19 pm Posts: 2559 Location: Oklahoma City, OK 73170 US
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 Re: Challenge
My point is that if you don't have an AK-47 your enemy is likely to laugh at you... and then go back to their beer...
no wait, that wasn't my point... The "public" scripts that are available, were given away just for that reason, so that you can shoot yourself with them...
_________________ Regards, Micro Website: http://www.microblaster.net TWGS2.20b/TW3.34: telnet://twgs.microblaster.net:2002
ICQ is Dead Jim! Join us on Discord: https://discord.gg/zvEbArscMN
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| Fri Oct 02, 2015 8:14 am |
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Cruncher
Ambassador
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 4016 Location: USA
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 Re: Challenge
Micro wrote: My point is that if you don't have an AK-47 your enemy is likely to laugh at you... and then go back to their beer...
no wait, that wasn't my point... The "public" scripts that are available, were given away just for that reason, so that you can shoot yourself with them... Exactly! Today's competitive games are so script heavy that you are basically just a bot on the team. Your bot masters are the ones doing all the "heavy lifting", everyone else sits back and drinks beer while watching their screen scroll. Their only responsibility is to make sure they are connected and the bot is on. The "Mega corps" that Kav was referring to were much more challenging to manage assets. The Mega Rob bug killed that.
_________________
BOTE 1998 Champs: Team Fament HHT 2015 Champs: Cloud09 Big Game 2016 Champs: Draft team HHT 2018 Champs: Rock Stars Big Game 2019 Champs: Draft Team
Classic Style Games Here: telnet://crunchers-twgs.com:2002 Web page from 1990's: https://web.archive.org/web/20170103155645/http://tradewars.fament.com/Cruncher/tradewar.htm Blog with current server info: http://cruncherstw.blogspot.com Discord: https://discord.gg/4dja5Z8 E-mail: Cruncherstw@gmail.com FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/CrunchersTW
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| Fri Oct 02, 2015 8:29 am |
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Kavanagh
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 1410 Location: Boo! inc. Ireland
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 Re: Challenge
Cruncher wrote: The "Mega corps" that Kav was referring to were much more challenging to manage assets. The Mega Rob bug killed that.
Yeah, reminds me of it. Redsafe and Bluesafe sectors behind the door, switching between them, demilitarising for the switches, yuck. Biggest issue I can remember was L5+. I can still remember a game '96 or so with overall CEO Sonic Boom electronically screaming in frustration "scan b4 u move" for intersector warping in the bbls with hot defenses : )
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| Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:29 am |
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Micro
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:19 pm Posts: 2559 Location: Oklahoma City, OK 73170 US
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 Re: Challenge
That would really suck, getting killed by your own defenses.... lol
_________________ Regards, Micro Website: http://www.microblaster.net TWGS2.20b/TW3.34: telnet://twgs.microblaster.net:2002
ICQ is Dead Jim! Join us on Discord: https://discord.gg/zvEbArscMN
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| Fri Oct 02, 2015 3:17 pm |
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